Hero is pro-Fascist eye-candy!

[Dobbs]

You think politics sucks, whatever whatever, then don't read this post.

I just wanted to say that the movie Hero, number one in China, big hit in U.S., world-wide sensation, Tarantino put his name on it a year after the fact - whatever - it's pro-Fascist.

Fuck the Salon review that says it isn't, it fucking is.

Looks pretty enough, but the message is bad. I will let the king kill me and my friends and other civilians and take over states because he wants us all to be one nation. Isn't that what certain much-hated fascists in world war II were all about - taking over various countries by force and making them part of the same (his) empire?

After this success, will there be a big budget pro-Mussolini film coming out of Italy soon? Probably not.

That's all.

[Pali]

You're kidding, right?

Well..if you're not. You're being pretty arrogant about what you've deemed to label 'facism.' Maybe you view any kind of dictatorship as fascist. A terrible mistake in my view. The unification of China is one of the most important moments in history for many Chinese people as I see it. It's not about one despot who's only motivation is a greed for power. It's about a leader's desire to unite a war torn country and end centuries of turmoil. So please, get a clue before you start typing.

Thanks!

[Pali]

It typically is, but throughout history there have been occasional examples of leader's who didnt become corrupted by the complete power given to them. George III is a good example, he's generally considered to be one of the more benevolent kings in Englands history (by modern morality). That is, before he went mad and let that camera crew into his castle to film him being 'wacky.' Later got turned into a film I believe..

Anyway, you're right, dictatorship's are dangerous and impractical. Purely because nine times out of ten you get a complete bastard!

The End.

[Dobbs]

Originally posted by Pali
You're kidding, right?

Well..if you're not. You're being pretty arrogant about what you've deemed to label 'facism.' Maybe you view any kind of dictatorship as fascist. A terrible mistake in my view. The unification of China is one of the most important moments in history for many Chinese people as I see it. It's not about one despot who's only motivation is a greed for power. It's about a leader's desire to unite a war torn country and end centuries of turmoil. So please, get a clue before you start typing.

Thanks!

Zheng persecuted/killed educated people and those who disagreed with him, destroyed books, killed civilians, etc. in his drive to "unify" China. How is that different than what other less popular Fascist dictators have tried to do? Maybe because he succeeded and they failed?

While the campaign to unify China may have turned out to be a relative success, that doesn't make the way it was done right or that a brutal dictator should be glorified.

Slavery was helpful to the economy of the United States for a long time - that doesn't prove that slavery is a good thing. :)

Your opinion may vary.

[Poocanoe]

I didnt really get that from the movie, i got "hey we're chinese and we can fly." I thought it had really pretty colors. I actually liked the movie a lot, good fight scenes, little bit of mystery, good stuff. It seems like if this "righteous" emperor wanted to unite the empire so they could live happily ever after, then he would have tried to do it peacefully. Maybe he did though and that wasnt in the movie. I think he was legit in his goals to unite china.

Anyway, did that movie seem really long to anyone else...maybe it was all the scenes with people just staring at each other and letting their baggy clothes flap in the wind.



:cool:

[Pali]

Originally posted by Dobbs
Zheng /killed educated people and those who disagreed with him, destroyed books, killed civilians, etc. in his drive to "unify" China. How is that different than what other less popular Fascist dictators have tried to do? Maybe because he succeeded and they failed?

While the campaign to unify China may have turned out to be a relative success, that doesn't make the way it was done right or that a brutal dictator should be glorified.


First I'd like to point out that 'Hero' is an openly fictional film. As such any specific names used really don't have any meaning.

In the film, the hero (that's Jet Li) gave up his life for the sake of a unified China, not for the emperor. There's your key point. The hero initially wants to kill this man because of the evil he has done, but once he realises that by doing so China would retreat back to the warring states period (a time in which the whole of China was carved up into seperate states each competing for dominance), he changes his mind.

He isn't thinking to himself 'this emperor guy is a real bastard, killing lots of innocent people and whatnot, but he's unifying china in the process, so that's OK!'

He's thinking something more along the lines of 'this emperor guy is a real bastard, killing lots of innocent people and whatnot, but what he's doing is the only way we could possibly end the last two centuries of conflict and unite China once and for all!'

Fact of the matter is, no one was going to end this civil conflict by being nice and benevolent. You see what I'm getting at?

So don't you go around trying to insinuate that I condone the 'ends justify the means' philosophy. Also, that thing about America using slaves to help the economy is a terrible example. Why? Because yes the American economy is strong these days, but it's morals are about as loose as they've ever been.

[agent_PUNT]

The world is fucked up. You can't just ignore the problems that exist today. I agree that the ends don't justify the means, but we have to deal with the shit that gets brought to us. There are people alive who don't want peace.

That is why Bush had to fight terrorism.

However, if you don't have plans to avoid future problems, ie if you don't feed and educate the children of countries you are bombing... then you'll just recreate the dangers you were trying to avoid.

Build more hospitals, not bombs.
Build more schools, not snipers.

An old saying, that I'll fuck up:

"It will be a great day when Schools get all the money they need and the ARMY will have to hold a bake sale to pay for new missles."

Deal with today's problems and use that to avoid problems in the future. That's what I got from Hero.

(I didn't see Hero, Bush sucks, his foreign policy is a joke, so is his economic reform)

[Pali]

You totally get it.

[agent_PUNT]

That "great defense is a good offense" BULLSHIT doesn't work, you want proof?

Look at the death penalty. It doesn't work as a deturant (spelling).

[agent_PUNT]

Yes, because Bush would never execute an innocent man. Oh wait, he did. Several times. In Texas.

The Death Penalty is supposed to be a deterant (spelling fuck).

How much advertising do you need for something called "The Death Penalty"?

I don't even know what the hell I'm talking about anymore.

[apotatojudge]

Originally posted by agent_PUNT
Yes, because Bush would never execute an innocent man. Oh wait, he did. Several times. In Texas.



In his defense, some of the ones that weren't guilty were retarded, so, y'know...

[Pali]

An eye for an eye...